Andruw Jones And The Hall Of Fame

by Braves

Greetings from Southeast Michigan where the denizens are all licking their wounds from the vicious beatings that the two marquee college football teams in the state (The University of Michigan and Michigan State University) took on New Year’s Day. As a U of M alum, all l can say is that I am closely monitoring the wire services and Twitter for mentions of Jim Harbaugh and Rich Rodriguez.

But on to the topic at hand: former Brave Andruw Jones and the Hall Of Fame. In case you missed it, their is a bit of a firestorm brewing, started by this article that basically states that Andruw and Derek Jeter are very comparable candidates for induction based on the currently “Hot” advanced metric of WAR (Wins Above Replacement). In truth, I think the author (Dave Cameron) sought out this case as an example of how divergent some of these new metrics are from “conventional wisdom”. He further states that he doesn’t think Andruw will even get the 5% of votes cast needed to stay on the HOF ballot. This prodded me to take a look at Andruw’s case for induction.

I guess WAR is as good a place to start as any. Andruw currently stands at 70.5 WAR for his career (for reference, Jeter is at 70.4 for his career). For those of you not familiar with the metric, it basically attempts to quantify the total value a player contributes to his team, both offensively and defensively, in comparison to the fictional “replacement” player, basically a “scrap heap” guy that can be found anywhere for the league minimum salary. A more in-depth discussion, if you’re interested, can be found here. Despite rumors to the contrary, Andruw’s career is not over, either. Even in part time roles, he has continued to post positive WAR numbers the past two seasons. And he’s still only 33 years old. With another 5 or 6 seasons to play, he’ll likely rack up another 5-10 wins on this metric. At that point you’re in pretty rarified air.

Where to look next? I guess spending a moment on defense is appropriate. Lest we forget, Andruw won 10 straight Gold Gloves. I don’t know how many center fielders have done this, but I strongly suspect I could count them on one hand. Shoot, I’m not sure I’d have to take off my shoes to be able to count the players at all positions who have accomplished this “feat” (couldn’t resist the pun; sorry!). When both the players and the stat-heads put a player’s defense at an elite level, I think you have to take notice.

Going back to the offensive side for a moment, how many of you realize that Andruw has hit 407 home runs? Even in part-time roles he’s hit 36 dingers in the past two years. That’s a HR every 16 AB’s, which is better than his career rate. That’s also better than Eddie Murray’s career rate. Or Stan Musial’s. Or Mel Ott’s. It’s better than many Hall-Of-Famers. Do you realize that, barring major injury, Andruw has a good chance of hitting 500 homers? And that he’s done it without the benefit of steroids?

He also has other singular accomplishments. He has a 50 HR season to his credit. He hit 2 homers in his first World Series game — at age 19, no less! He was the second-youngest player to reach 300 home runs. He has made 5 All-Star teams. He’s been runner up to the MVP. He’s had 5 seasons of 100+ RBI’s as a center fielder (and 9 seasons of 90+, eight of them in a row). He’s a member of the 20-20 club. He has made a career of highlight reel catches. He was durable, playing at least 153 games nine straight seasons.

On the not-so-positive side, he’s seldom hit for average. He’s perfected the art of swinging at breaking stuff in the dirt. And he’ll forever be marked by his epic meltdown in LA (he might have earned about $500,000 a hit for the Dodgers!). Even with all this, though, he’s still put up an OBP of .338, an OPS of .826, and an OPS+ of 111 for his career. And Baseball-Reference shows Dale Murphy and Reggie Jackson as his most similar players.

So, what do you think: will Andruw be the only non-steroid-tainted player to hit 500 home runs and not be elected to the hall? Will he be able to exceed the 5% of the votes needed to stay on the ballot? What’ll he need to do (if there’s anything he can do) over the rest of his career to make the Hall? Can his combination of power and defense make up for his shortcomings? I personally think that he’ll get the same credit for his defense as Dale Murphy gets for character, and will probably get about the same vote totals.

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A prolonged resurgent Andruw would make him a better candidate. The Hall of Fame is theoretically for the Famous I suppose but it was started to be for the elite player of their time. I don't want it to be come the NBA/NFL hall of pretty good. I'd rather have fewer in than dilute it.
I think any voter who returns a blank ballot or a ballot filled with nonsensical selections like Surhoff or Marquis Grissom should lose their votes permanently. Those folks don't take their role seriously and would be better off writing for the local weekly advertiser.

I know this is late, I had a reply the other day then got sidetracked. I'm saying no. That's not because Andruw wasn't the best in center field of his time or because I don't think he belongs in the Braves HoF. It's more to do with the Hall of Fame turning into the Hall of really pretty good.
All the attention on the shoddy voting this week by members the BBWA and the turn towards sabermetrics makes me cynical of the Hall's future. Hell I'm cynical of it's recent past. There are lots of players in because they were great guys and had a few good years; Kirby Puckett comes to mind, a great guy but a top 1% player? Based on his body of work no. I loved listening to Mazerowski whip the Yankees in 60 but he's not a HoF guy either. The imposition of the recurring pinch hitter on baseball by the amateur err. . American League owners further dilutes the Hall as eventually a guy who plays. . .make that is on the field. . .less than 15 minutes a game is inducted purely for that. Disgusting. But back to Andruw and his potential.
Andruw is one of the two or three best centerfielders of all time along with Willie and Mickey. Add that to his early hitting - say up to 2005 - and he was on track to be that guy. Then he forgot how to be what he is and tried to be what he wants to be; the main man, slugger par excellence and go to guy. He began striking out more and listening to coaches less. A good breaking ball befuddles him and rather than shorten up and foul it off and make them pitch to him as a hall of fame hitter would do, he swings like the old garden gate and connects with nothing. Further he didn't listen to any of the hitting coaches that tried to fix him including Rudy Jaramillo who is touted as the best at fixing hitters currently coaching. Unfortunately he's no longer the 5 tool player who came to the bigs hitting, stealing and fielding like Mays reincarnated and his body of work is too shallow. As Yogi might say given the chance, he got old really young. All that considered, Andruw is welcome in the hall of almost but not quite but not the Hall of Fame.

Hi Merlin,

Late's fine by me!

Good points on Andruw.

I've gone back and forth on this in my mind, but right now I guess I'd say that I'm more in favor of a more inclusionary Hall. While I think that anyone who voted for Surhoff should have his voting rights pulled, I think the Hall is really there for the fans, especially the fans who aren't quite as nut ball over the sport as we are. I think including more of the borderline guys makes it a better experience for those fans, and can be done without any real dilution of the overall Hall. Of course, since the Hall itself issues no guidance and is mostly interested in drawing attention to itself through discussions like this at bars and blogs across the world, it's an issue with no resolution ever, IMO.

You know, at 33 Andruw really could have a career resurgence. Seems his only injury problem (so to speak) is on the cognitive side. Lose 30 pounds and lay off the low and away breaking stuff and I think he's an All-Star again. One can hope, I suppose.

Bob

I linked to your blog in my most recent article, just letting you know.

Keep up the good writing!

Tom
www.cardinalsgm.com
BBA member

Thanks Tom; I really appreciate it! Keep up the great work on your end as well!

Bob

In my opinion, he should make the Hall of Fame, He's only 33 and doing very well in only a limited role the past two years, if given a chance a full DH duties or 100+ games in and outfield role, he could improve his career number and help a team improve and succeed, he still has power (36HR in 559AB past 2 seasons)thats a better pace than over 8 different seasons that he finished with at least 36 HR and 560AB. And even as an average field now-a-days he's probably one of the better defensive outfielders. I believe he's a Hall of Famer, and if you dont remember given a chance at a full time DH or OF job or not he has a chance it improve his numbers with possibly 500+ HR, 10+ GG Highlight reel, and still a better WAR than Derek Jeter lol

Hi Rob,

Welcome to Tomahawk Take!

All the points you make are excellent. I obviously think that a case can be made for Andruw. I just think his "fall from grace" was so dramatic and memorable that it probably erases his chances. But I also think that "Good Andruw", as we used to call him when he was locked in, is still quite capable of hitting 35+ HR's, given the opportunity. If Andruw hits 500+ HR's, that's when I think the writers are going to have to think really hard before rejecting him.

Bob

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  2. [...] Bob Horton published a similar article on Jones over at Tomahawk Take.  I suggest you check it out, it's very [...]